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Author Topic: tape pack deformation problems..  (Read 4744 times)

Offline Gkar

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tape pack deformation problems..
« on: January 17, 2011, 11:53:00 AM »
howdy, all, I was wondering about the problems inherent when a reel of tape packs onto the reel with some deformation showing in the packing, ie., it may manifest as flat spots in the pack or wavy spots and/or humping as opposed to normal arcuate packing, and what appears to be a radial lines/areas visible in the library wound, packed tape.  I saw some of this on Richard Hess's site and was wondering what effect this has on tape, both during play and for long term storage/use.  On one tape I note this effect, I do not seem to hear any playback problems, perhaps more careful listening will be needed, in others, there are audible issues.  Also, tapes having this problem also seem to have problems where the tape does not pack flat, there is often areas where the tape edges are high or low on a couple of laps, or a fair section of the pack will have tape edges alternating high and low as the tape packs onto the reel...  thanks
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Offline ironbut

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Re: tape pack deformation problems..
« Reply #1 on: January 17, 2011, 02:36:38 PM »
Hi Randy,
If it's an older tape that has the "poor pack" issue, and it seems isolated to only a few tapes in you collection, than it's either a problem with the reel or it's probably that the tape has some damage. Some older tapes that I have that have this issue seem to be the result of having been played on a poorly adjusted machine or poor storage practices.
If the machine forces the tape to one side or the other, that edge gets damaged from friction. An extreme case is something called curling where the wear of the tape forms a sharp edge on a guide or two which will eventually slice tiny "curls" off of that edge of the tape. When that happens, the tape will wander a bit on it's way to the tape up reel and this causes poor tape packing.
If it was stored with a bad pack, the forces that pull the tape toward the center of the reel will cause the edge, that's not supported by the layers underneath it, to become shorter and the overall shape of the tape width will become "cupped". Severe cupping will prevent proper tape/head contact and the channel on that edge will have a lower output as a result of spacing error.

So, that last part is one of the problems with not storing your tapes with a nice shiny tape pack. How long and if your tape will get cupped depends on tape type, storage conditions and just how badly the tape pack is skewed. One way to minimize this problem (other than finding a way to get a good pack) is to play the tape fairly often. Since it's almost impossible for the layers of tape to be aligned to one another after any given play, the forces will be distributed in different ways and cupping is much less likely. Most severe cupping occurs from decades of storage without "exercising" the tape.

The first thing to try is to move the tape onto another reel though.
steve koto
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Offline Gkar

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Re: tape pack deformation problems..
« Reply #2 on: January 17, 2011, 04:20:01 PM »
thanks, Steve, I may try that new reel suggestion, the tape itself seems to play fine but just lays up funny with noticeable "spoking" as discussed on Richard Hess's website.  I am just a bit concerned as to longevity since this reel 2 of 3 in Gotterdamerung and if this is going to become a problem I would want to send it back to Polyphony.  Thanks, Randy
"Music possesses far richer means of expression, and it is a more subtle medium in which to translate the thousand shifting moments in the mood of a soul." - Tchaikovsky

Offline ironbut

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Re: tape pack deformation problems..
« Reply #3 on: January 17, 2011, 05:28:04 PM »
If it sounds OK than I'd keep it and just be sure and take good care of it.
If it's part of the Solti/Birgit Nilsson Ring (London U90098) be happy that you got a playable one. I've bought 2 copies of that one and still haven't got a decent one! It does sound pretty darn nice though.
steve koto
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Offline Gkar

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Re: tape pack deformation problems..
« Reply #4 on: January 17, 2011, 08:17:11 PM »
yes, Steve, it is part of that Ring recording.  The tapes do sound good, but I went through reel 2 again tonite and now I know what is going on, edge ripple on side 2 of reel 2!  I'll turn that reel over and play side 2 to see if the sound is affected, the ripple looks pretty bad watching from side 1...  for whatever reason there seems to be problems getting good complete sets of those recordings, they are not rare, but it make take a couple of sets to make one good one, my Walkure reel 1 has poor slitting midway thru, haven't tried the other reels yet though...
"Music possesses far richer means of expression, and it is a more subtle medium in which to translate the thousand shifting moments in the mood of a soul." - Tchaikovsky