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Author Topic: Need Tape Machine to convert 17 1950's reels to digital media  (Read 7508 times)

Offline BVH

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Hello and just registered  to try to get some info before I get myself in over my head.  I'm one of 4 siblings in their early 60's.  My sis discovered 17 reels of 7", 1/4"  audio tapes of many family members made by my long deceased Aunt Lucy back during the 50's.  These were made each Christmas and contain audio/voices (no music) of all family members babbling whatever came to mind at the time.  Needles to say, I was 7 or younger at the time and the only thing I remember about the machine is that is had a big green pilot light letting you know when it was recording.  Sis also tells me it's my job to get these converted to digital.  I'm a very technical guy with things electrical and mechanical, PC's so I understand how to make connections and that I'll have to buy some type of analog to digital box or just a PC sound card with the right inputs and outputs.  I'm going to guess that all the tapes are mono (although I do not know this.  Were there stereo tape decks in the mid to late 50's?)  I see outside services charge from $30 up per reel, some based on time etc.  This is a project I would enjoy doing myself so I figure I'll pick up a used machine on Ebay and get it done.  I was hoping for some suggestions on a "good quality" machine to look for and I am unsure about "newer" (60's/70's/80's/90's) machines being able to play old mono tapes.  Is there an issue with this?  Once converted, I will simply put the machine back on Ebay as I will have no use for it.  I'd also like some recommendations on a good sound card or exterior A/D converter for this purpose.  Seems some articles recommend 24 bit, 96khtz sampling rates.  I'm not too good in this area of expertise so again, would like some recommendations.  Sis says she briefly unwound about 3' of tape off of a few reels and that it looks clean, does not stick to itself so hopefully, they are in decent shape.  I've asked her to provide some pics of the reels and their boxes so I have a better idea of what we have.  Maybe they will indicate at what speed they were recorded at so I can ensure that whatever machine I buy will play them correctly.

Offline Listens2tubes

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Re: Need Tape Machine to convert 17 1950's reels to digital media
« Reply #1 on: May 18, 2013, 03:20:27 PM »
Welcome to the Tape Project Forum. For this project you need either a 2 track stereo or single track mono deck. Where are you located? It may be possible to find someone in your area who can help you figure out what the format is. Then you will know what direction to go toward finding the correct machine.

Also you may find http://www.tapeheads.com to also be a great resource.
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Offline BVH

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Re: Need Tape Machine to convert 17 1950's reels to digital media
« Reply #2 on: May 18, 2013, 06:07:50 PM »
I'm in Pismo Beach  Ca (central coast) kind of a small populated area.  I'll do some investigating to see if there are any transfer services around to possibly help me determine original recording speed.  Thank you for the info and resource.

Offline ironbut

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Re: Need Tape Machine to convert 17 1950's reels to digital media
« Reply #3 on: May 18, 2013, 10:10:39 PM »
Hey BVH (btw, we use our real names here on this forum),

There are a few questions, as Neal mentioned, that need to be answered which are best done by playing them.
The basic format is mono or dual mono almost for sure. Unless your aunt used more than one machine, almost all of them from that era were one of those two mono formats. Possibly, that green light that you remember was the level indicator which was used on many consumer type machines in lieu of VU meters.
Aside from that, there's the question of tape speed. Most of the times, these tapes are recorded at some pretty low speeds (usually 3 3/4 inches per second). These lower speeds can be adjusted once the contents is digitized and loaded into and editor.
A free editor like Audacity should work fine for your purposes.
There's little to be gained from transferring these tapes to a sample rate above 44.1 and seeing that you'd have a tough time finding an AD converter that doesn't operate at 24/96 these days, just about any external USB or firewire interface should do. You could easily pick one up used for under $100.

As far as the condition of the tapes goes, that's really the key question here.
Most tape produced in the 50's to early 60's was acetate. Unlike more modern poly backed tape, acetate seldom becomes sticky. Most of the time the acetate "drys out" and becomes brittle and or the oxide layer will come off of the backing.
It's hard to guess when these things will happen but quite often the tape and box will have a strong vinegar smell and you can see an brownish outline of the reel in the box.
These tapes can be played but great care needs to be take to prevent multiple breaks.
There are ways to "re hydrate" acetate tapes but that sort of thing is best left to experienced restoration folks.
Mold is another issue. It usually appears as a white dusty deposit on the sides of the tape. It is bad to breath the spores of this mold and playing (and rewinding especially) will distribute the spores.

If I were in your shoes, I'd be looking for a 1/2 track machine with at least a 3 3/4 ips speed. If the tapes are full track mono, you could use the channel that produces the best sound if the tapes are cupped (which often happens to these acetate tapes). If the tapes are badly cupped, you could also "rig" up a piece of felt to "ride" the back of the tape and hold it against the playback head so it will make better contact.
If the tapes are "dual Mono", in which there are two mono track taking up half of the tape width, one in each direction, you'd also be able to use one channel of the 1/2 track head playback.

As you can tell, transferring old tapes correctly without damaging them and/or losing the audio that you're trying to save can be difficult.
It can be challenging to do yourself but more than a few folks have done it.
I would second Neal's suggestion to find someone who already has a machine he knows and start from there.
Buying one off of eBay and getting it working can be an adventure in itself.

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Offline steveidosound

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Re: Need Tape Machine to convert 17 1950's reels to digital media
« Reply #4 on: May 18, 2013, 11:01:48 PM »
Hi,
I would be so bold as to suggest that if the tapes were on 7" reels and recorded on some tube-based consumer machine of the 50s era, the most  likely format for them to be in is what is called  "2 track" or "1/2 track" mono, containing 2 mono tracks, each covering half the width, where the reels were flipped at the end, and the tape was played or recorded on the other half till it was back on the reel it started from. So be sure and recover side 2 (if any) when you transfer. The 2 most common speeds were 7 1/2 and 3 3/4 inches per second. The good news is that these sorts of self contained, mono recorders were very common up through the end of the 1960s and would have been solid state on the later units.
As any of the machines are over 40 years old, as was pointed out, it is hard to find one in really reliable good working condition to transfer long hours of tape, which may be fairly fragile now, as was also pointed out. Capacitors and rubber drive belts and wheels slowly fail over time, tape heads wear,  grease gets sticky, and of course things get dirty.  But I have found machines of this era that are still working more or less as designed.
Most will have an external headphone monitor or speaker output, which typically is a mono mini jack or perhaps 1/4" jack. You might find one with an RCA "line out" jack. This would be preferable for a clean output to your computer's input. Sometimes the level can be an issue with some sound cards and USB devices. A volume control dependent external speaker out into a microphone input on the computer will probably yield a somewhat noisy and/or possibly overloaded, distorted level into the computer. A computer with stereo line in with the single mono output "Y"ed to L & R channels should work best. If it is speaker level there will be an optimum setting of the recorders volume control for level vs noise.

If you end up with a stereo deck, it can still work, but you will use only the left channel output, as the right channel will give you the other side of your tape playing backwards! This is due to the peculiar way stereo was done vs mono on reel to reel tape. If, BTW you play the tapes on a stereo deck and both channels yield normal output, it was recorded on a stereo deck, but not so likely in the 50s, especially with one big green "eye" meter. (very typically a Webcor or VM)

Not to be too discouraging, but a quick look at Craigslist in the  SLO, Santa Barbara and Bakersfield areas did not yield anything that particularly looked suitable. Oh well...

A basic, school A/V type Wollensak, Sony TC-104 or 105 or Califone/Rheem might be a good place to start looking on eBay.
Make sure you do  _not_ get a battery powered 5" reel mono machine. These are also very very common, but obviously will not play your 7" reels.
BTW, one meter and one set of inputs and outputs are your clues that it is not a stereo unit.
« Last Edit: May 19, 2013, 12:15:15 AM by steveidosound »
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